Cob: RE: Insulation

[jkell]

Well we are getting a lot of heat out of this arguing, aren't we?
By the way don't people use cellulose insulation in many cold areas?
I thought it worked well when used in ceilings and walls, I do not think it
is apropriate(not sustainable) for the few that are opting for sustainable
living, but..
I believe that with cob the one way to do it is with straw, and some type of
additional small steeldrum fire place that can be left outside in the warm
month, these produce a lot of heat in a very short time with very little
wood, and the thick cob walls will hold this heat in for quite a while, John
Fordice's idea of strawbale exterior insulation would be the ticket for the
outside, remember that not all the folks are looking to change their
residences to cob, it could be fun though!
jorg kell
-----Original Message-----
From: bluemoon <bluemoon at sympatico.ca>
To: coblist at deatech.com <coblist at deatech.com>
Date: Saturday, July 17, 1999 4:46 PM
Subject: Re: Cob: RE: Insulation


>
>
>
>sojournr at missouri.org wrote:
>.
>> *sigh*  Actually we were discussing ways to get some insulation into a
>> cob building.
>
>I may be wrong but people interested in cob building WANT sustainable
>energy. That is why the question of R value often comes up. Wood is a form
>of heating a cob house. Sustainably.
>
>
>> However, the point I made was that you cannot expect wood heat to be
>> truly sustainable on a large scale.  It's certainly sustainable on a
>> small scale, for those who have the space to keep a woodlot to fill
>> their needs.  And I said that, exactly.
>
>You also said not to include the southern US. Therefore not everyone would
>be burning wood, now would they? Thus, it reduces the amount of people who
>WOULD and WANT to burn wood. This is a personal choice.
>
>
>> I personally don't think we can talk about "sustainability" while
>> ignoring 80% of the population (or more) that live in urban and suburban
>> regions.
>
>You are correct and this was never implied.
>
>> And many people WOULD think twice about switching to wood stoves or a
>> wood-fired furnace - just try to find an insurance company that will
>> carry your policy, at least here in the US.  Maybe its different in
>> Canada.
>
>No, it is not BUT after the ice storms, most people installed wood stoves
AS
>back-ups only.
>
>
>> Oh come on.  That was quite clearly given as an example of why what may
>> be sustainable on a small scale is NOT sustainable on a large scale.
>
>Was it? We were discussing heating cob homes. How many are actually
building
>in the city? Is your example of a guy peeing a suitable example to this
line
>of discussion? NO
>
>
>> Now, if you don't want to discuss sustainability in such a fashion as to
>> include the majority of the planet, that's your perogative.  But
>> personally I don't think it does much good to think that a tiny majority
>> of people living out in the middle of nowhere burning wood for fuel is
>> going to help the environment much.
>
>Oh I forgot, everyone needs to reform immediately to help the environment.
>Do we not need to begin somewhere? As for YOUR terms of sustainability, you
>think concrete is not harmful to the environment. The energy it takes to
>create concrete, makes it unsustainable. It is not pleasing nor long
>lasting. Concrete does crack and chip.
>
>
>> No, you totally missed my point.  The point I was making is that just
>> because you are fortunate enough to be able to count on solar gain for
>> some heating effect in the winter doesn't mean that everyone can.  Yet
>> you make statements that seem to imply that this is the solution for all
>> possible situations.  Maybe you didn't mean to, but you did.
>
>Do you understand the concept of passive solar energy?? It includes
blocking
>the wind, naturally  cooling  and taking advantage of the sun as MUCH as
you
>can for the area you live. Not relying on the sun to heat your home-even
>partially. And I never implied everyone should  nor did I say it was the
>only way.  Please don't make assumptions(second time I told you this)
>>
>> Remember, this thread is aimed at a couple of people who want to find
>> ways to increase the insulative properties of their cob homes in a
>> northern climate.  They don't live in areas where they can count on
>> solar gain in the winter to be much help.
>>
>> In other words, IT'S NOT ABOUT YOU.
>
>'nough said oh Queen of the cob list. I never implied EVER that it was
about
>me. Maybe someone else has this problem as it seems you sure are far more
>opinionated than educated about sustainability and  communicating
>effectively
>
>
>> The issue was keeping warm.  Therefore I was discussing solarization
>> from the point of view OF keeping warm, which is not practicable in many
>> areas.
>
>Again,  please inform yourself on the concept of passive solar energy
>
>> I never said a thing about active solar systems.  The point I was making
>> is that you can't even get any PASSIVE solar gain when there IS NO SUN.
>
>Really? geesh,never knew that.
>.
>> Ditto for passive solar design.  FOR THE QUESTION AT HAND, which is how
>> to keep a cob building warm in a Northern climate where a passive solar
>> HEATING EFFECT (note that is NOT the same as heat from an active solar
>> system) cannot be relied upon, insulation strikes me as being a pretty
>> important issue.
>
>Insulation is important. BUT the WAY a cob house is designed is just as
>important as insulation and heating.
>
>> Now, do you want to talk about insulating a cob structure?  Or do you
>> want to keep beating the dead solar horse?
>
>what solar horse????????????
>~Diana
>
>